AMD 780G: Preview of the Best Current IGP Solution
by Gary Key on March 10, 2008 12:00 PM EST- Posted in
- CPUs
Test Setup
The Gigabyte GA-MA780GM-S2H was selected as our AMD 780G platform representative today. AMD provided this board for the press kits as it is one of the most feature laden 780G boards in the market, and Gigabyte has ensured widespread availability over the next couple of weeks. The board we are using is an actual retail kit purchased to guarantee our testing results are representative of product in the retail channel. To be honest, the retail board performed identically to our review sample during testing, so that should put any thoughts about cherry-picked samples to rest.
| Gigabyte MA78GM-S2H Testbed | |
| Processor | AMD Athlon 64 X2 4850E Dual-core, 2.5GHz, 2 x 512KB L2 Cache, 12.5x Multiplier |
| CPU Voltage | 1.250V |
| Cooling | AMD Retail |
| Power Supply | Seasonic SS-430GB |
| Memory | OCZ PC2-6400 ATI Edition (4x1GB) |
| Memory Settings | DDR2-800, 4-4-4-12 1.90V |
| Video Cards | On-board HD3200 |
| Video Drivers | AMD 8.3 |
| Hard Drive | Samsung HD501LJ |
| Optical Drives | Sony BDU-X10S |
| Case | Silverstone SG03 |
| Operating System | Windows Vista Ultimate 32-bit |
| . | |
| ASUS P5E-VM HDMI Testbed | |
| Processor | Intel Core 2 Duo E2200 Dual-core, 2.20GHz, 1MB L2 Cache, 800FSB, 11x Multiplier |
| CPU Voltage | 1.250V |
| Cooling | Intel Retail |
| Power Supply | Seasonic SS-430GB |
| Memory | OCZ PC2-6400 ATI Edition (4x1GB) |
| Memory Settings | DDR2-800, 4-4-4-12 1.90V |
| Video Cards | On-board X3500 |
| Video Drivers | Intel 15.8 |
| Hard Drive | Samsung HD501LJ |
| Optical Drives | Sony BDU-X10S |
| Case | Silverstone SG03 |
| Operating System | Windows Vista Ultimate 32-bit |
| . | |
| ASUS M3N78-EMH HDMI Testbed | |
| Processor | AMD Athlon 64 X2 4850E Dual-core, 2.5GHz, 2 x 512KB L2 Cache, 12.5x Multiplier |
| CPU Voltage | 1.250V |
| Cooling | AMD Retail |
| Power Supply | CORSAIR CMPSU-550VX |
| Memory | OCZ PC2-6400 ATI Edition (4x1GB) |
| Memory Settings | DDR2-800, 4-4-4-12 2.00V |
| Video Cards | On-board GeForce 8200 |
| Video Drivers | NVIDIA 173.68 |
| Hard Drive | Samsung HD501LJ |
| Optical Drives | Sony BDU-X10S |
| Case | Silverstone SG03 |
| Operating System | Windows Vista Ultimate 32-bit |
| . | |
Our tests today will concentrate on High Definition image quality output and CPU utilization rates. We are currently working on a five-board roundup that will feature 780G boards from Gigabyte, ASUS, J&W, and ECS. We will go into detail about general performance in the areas of gaming, networking, applications, and overclocking in that article.
Based on the 780G’s penchant for HD playback, we figured the natural competitors in this particular segment would be the Intel G35 and NVIDIA GeForce 8200. Fortunately, our retail GeForce 8200 sample just arrived, but we will be using beta drivers with the GeForce 8200. NVIDIA has not updated the drivers since introducing the chipset in January, so our results could change with final release code. In the meantime, we will pit the 780G against the G35 with publicly available drivers and continue to hope that NVIDIA will answer our requests for a new driver release.
We selected identical components for our three testbeds, with the obvious exception of the motherboard and CPU. Our choice of processors represents the budget-minded user to a certain degree, with AMD’s new 4850e X2 and Intel’s E2200 both retailing for $90. AMD expects to start shipping the 4850e shortly. We ended up having to switch out our Seasonic SS-430GB power supply for a Corsair CMPSU-550VX power supply. The ASUS M3N78-EMH just did not care for our Seasonic power supply during testing as the board would randomly shutdown.
We will provide quad-core results in our follow-up with all three chipsets. One important fact about the 780G and Phenom combination is this combination will perform post-processing on high-definition content. It makes a difference in image quality and fluidity during 1080p playback that we are still trying to capture at this moment.
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derek85 - Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - link
You certainly don't know anything about multimedia.With a 780G + Phenom + 2ch DDR2-667 or 800 you are getting almost full HDHQV scores; with 8300GS the memory on those cards are severely limited to single channel DDR2-800 and you are not getting ANY HDHQV features, the image quality would be very poor in comparison, and there is no way to remedy that no matter how powerful your CPU is.
You said Phenom is not a good overclocker, and I agree with that, but what you got wrong is the market that 780G is aiming at. At this price point most people would never look at overclocking their PC, heck the average joe out there probably don't even know what's actually inside their computer case. The 780G will make a very good platform for everyday as well as a HTPC, and I'm sure it will be a good pick for OEMs.
derek85 - Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - link
Guess I hit enter button too soon...What I was trying to say is 780G excels in multimedia and will make its way into a damn good budget PC. You are looking at $50-60 saving in an entry level discrete graphics card, and probably $20-30 more on the motherboard at current running price for 780G. 780G will also do just fine in light gaming and usual productivity tasks. It can score 1600+ in 3DMark06, and a 8400GS is not going to do any better than that.
gochichi - Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - link
OK, so I'm excited for AMD. This kind of makes them really feasible again. I mean, for the price of a cheap video card... they throw in a free (and pretty decent) motherboard.I once read that some AMD official (maybe even the president, don't remember) thought that things are so tight in the CPU industry that it's a lot more profitable to make CPU cooling.
Well??? C'MON! There is currently no mainstream HTPC system. AMD could really sell these IF they could sell it even more as a platform. Why leave it up to so-far so-chintzy 3rd parties to make something decent.
What I would like to see is a "genuine" AMD thin case, with a power supply and a new type of AMD chip that comes with a flatter CPU cooler. All I want is space for one harddrive, and one 5.25" drive... make it as tight and slick as possible, and make it relatively affordable. Why not?
I mean, I know it won't happen. But it should. This promises tighter integration, and I believe that making this integration visible to the consumer via a slick AMD-branded case (work with Antec, Lian-Li or just AMD) that draws attention to the near console price that you can now build a system with.
Also, because Vista is so expensive to the people building their own machine. It is critical for them to offer splendid Linux support. If I knew it was plug & play with the next Ubuntu including audio through HDMI... that would sell it to me all over again.
AMD ALMOST has the price-point going on. Vista messes that up, expensive and UNIMPRESSIVE cases/power supplies messes that up as well.
Do you people realize that a Mac Min is currently the cheapest slick-form factor computer available??? How can that be? Apple is EXPENSIVE!?! It doesn't need to be ridiculously small... but slicker than the crap that's available.
Asus makes something like I have in mind but it's ran on Intel and is expensive as all get out.
AMD... give us the humble little platform that could. You're SO close now.
JarredWalton - Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - link
You know, I reviewed an Aopen MiniPC a long time ago. I burned out one fan in the process of a one month review. Okay, sure, I was stress-testing with Folding@Home, but that still gives me pause. Then I got a new fan, finished the review, and about two months later (without stress testing) the second fan gave out! I'd assume the Mac Mini is doing better than Aopen, since I haven't heard any uproar, but then I don't follow Macs much.More to the point, going *small* has some potential drawbacks. After initially being impressed by SFF and other small systems, I'm pretty much done with them now. uATX is more or less viable, but if you're looking for long-term reliability and don't want overheating and premature part failures, I would stick with a decent ATX case. The uATX stuff just never seems quite as robust after a couple years of use, IMO.
gochichi - Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - link
The Mac Mini wannabe that you're talking about was not what I had in mind. What I am saying is that buying a Mac Mini, and installing Windows Vista for $100.00 is still cheaper than most small/slick form factors.Now, Mac Mini is absurdly small (it's very well executed, and reliable as hell, but the slow harddrive etc is absurd IMHO). I'm suggesting something 8 times as big or so (2 mac minis tall, 4 per layer-ish). Just make it slick. It's REALLY not that hard!
I keep thinking I should just cast an aluminum case from scratch b/c the market is that lame. The few cases that aren't lame are over priced as hell. I suppose the really small HP is fine, (perfect even in terms of size/$/sacrifices). But what about the people that want to buy something from scratch and not undergo armed robbery and chintziness all at the same time.
AMD is unable to take things to the next level. This new vision of "lets not beat Intel in performance/$" COULD work, but it would need a gimmick. They are definitely missing that gimmick although this new chipset came close.
The only actual contribution to the world that this chipset has made is that Intel will beat it (or compete with it) and since Intel has stellar Linux support, better CPUs, and better battery life on laptops etc... that will be good. I really only need so much from a graphics card most of the time, and this 780G covers NEEDS.
phusg - Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - link
What's wrong with Shuttle SFF PC's? Sure the internal PSU crapped out on me after a few years, but I think mine looks pretty good.I do agree with your parent post though that SFF isn't really worth the hassle in a lot of cases. A HTPC is often accompanied by an AV Receiver and TV that are often both easily as big as ATX, so what's the point in going small for the PC component? I'm currently building a recylcled ATX machine as a HTPC to replace my Shuttle and am sure I will love the extra expansion slots, cooler temps and quieter operation. If AMD would just make a decent AGP driver release all will be good again...
JarredWalton - Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - link
What's wrong? I suppose it all depends on the TLC you give your computer. I'd *never* recommend overclocking Shuttle - or any other - SFFs. I did that in my early SFF reviews. Some of those systems I kept overclocked (and we're talking mild 10-20% overclocks), and most would fail within a year. Even *without* overclocking, nearly every SFF I've ever used failed in some manner before two years was up.Shuttle did better in this regard than others, but the long-term prospects are pretty poor. I had several motherboards fail (will no longer POST at all). I've had fan controllers fail on at least two units - still usable, but now you need to plug into a regular Molex connector and run the fan at 100%. PSUs have failed on maybe 1/3 of the SFFs I've used (within a two year period - most last at least a year).
The real issue with the above is that all SFFs are proprietary, so when something inevitably *does* fail, you get raped on price a second time. And taking the motherboard or PSU out of an SFF is not nearly as easy as in a uATX/ATX system. If you want the wiring to look nice again - which is actually critical in such a small chassis since it affects airflow - you're looking at many hours of work.
gochichi - Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - link
Building a computer on the cheap, doesn't add up anymore.AMD would be wise to partner up and make a conveniently priced, conveniently sized, platform. Because if the price is right and it's convenient then their performance deficit is not important.
sprockkets - Thursday, March 13, 2008 - link
They could always release a DTX board, like they said over a year ago.panfist - Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - link
Will it be worth waiting for a 790GX? Or if I want that much performance, just go with discrete graphics that's better than hybrid crossfire anyway?What's the best AMD HTPC board that uses discrete graphics?